Sellings Organs

King_Leopold · 02-09-2008

Heh ok, one last topic for tonight. Should people be allowed to sell their organs for money (kidneys and things like that)?

Personally, beats me, Ill have to think on it, never thoiugh about it till I made this post.

graal · 02-09-2008

I never thought about it either, but I think it shouldn't be allowed, that would start to be a REALLY bad black market... and people can't really have a totally normal life with only 1 kidney... also, there aren't so many organs that could be sold... (I mean, that people don't need, and others do)

I am kinda against selling blood, if you wanna know my opinion... many people who couldn't really give blood (because might have some disease still on first stages, when it can't be detected, or have given blood too little time ago) go and sell the blood because need some extra money... imagine if you could do it with organs... If blood couldn't be sold, only given, there wouldn't be those irregularities, only people really willing to give it and who knew that did not have any problem...

Typewriter · 02-09-2008

I think if that was legalised graveyards would be bare from organed dead people within a month - people would dig graves, get organs, sell organs, put body back in ground.

graal · 02-09-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Typewriter

I think if that was legalised graveyards would be bare from organed dead people within a month - people would dig graves, get organs, sell organs, put body back in ground.

Lol! I really don't think so... it would be more likely to people being killed for that... organs in graveyard would be useless... (dead organs can't be used, they need to be fresh)

Also, if it was legalized, it would probably be like "come to the clinic and we will take your organ and pay you"... they wouldn't buy the organ... because people can't go to their homes, take a knife, take off the organ and then go sell on a shop...

HyperReaper33 · 02-09-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by graal

... because people can't go to their homes, take a knife, take off the organ and then go sell on a shop...

And if they did, I would let them sell it for being such a badass.

King Stubby · 02-09-2008

i think it'd be illegal, because who would be selling their organs? homeless people. then not only would they have no home or food or money, they'd have a missing kidney!

King_Leopold · 02-09-2008

The idea behind behind making it legal, is you wouldnt have a blackmarket, everything would be regulated. I didn't mean like graverobbing lol

Pros:
More organs would definately be available, and many people die before they can get transplants

Cons;
You are paying for body parts.

graal · 02-09-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by King_Leopold

The idea behind behind making it legal, is you wouldnt have a blackmarket, everything would be regulated. I didn't mean like graverobbing lol

Pros:
More organs would definately be available, and many people die before they can get transplants

Cons;
You are paying for body parts.

I think it would be much easier to allow embrionaire cells research... so, we would eventually be able to replace these organs without the need of someone giving/selling these organs...

and imagine the auction it would be for organs... you go somewhere and people start to make better offers for your organs... it would be ridiculous, seriously... (people could even start having children only to sell their organs...)

King Stubby · 02-09-2008

Well, I'm pretty sure donating is okay. If you did get payed for donating an organ, they wouldn't pay much. (except in the knowledge that you saved someone's life)

King_Leopold · 02-09-2008

well i made the topic because i read an article about how more and more people are going to other countries like china and india to get transplants from people who are getting money when they give their organs. They are also illegal organ markets, Im not talking about those.

graal · 02-09-2008

But I am in favor of paying for organs donated after death... (a fixed price for each organ), so families would be more likely to donate the dead person's organs... it would really increase the donations, in my opinion... but I am still against donating living people organs.

King_Leopold · 02-09-2008

thats an interesting idea, who would you suggest pays though, the people getting the organs, or the governments for them

graal · 02-09-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by King_Leopold

thats an interesting idea, who would you suggest pays though, the people getting the organs, or the governments for them

The governments, there would be a fixed price, and if the family decided to donate the organs, they would receive the that amout for the organ... (each organ with its price)... then, if the government was going to charge whoever is gonna receive the organ, it is a diferent history... I guess it would depend on the government and the taxes of the country...

If the government charged for the organs, we would have an ethical problem... because the rich would have higher chances of surviving than the poor (and as everyone has the right to live, one can't have a higher right to live only because he is rich, it is against the constitution), and it would create many movements against it... so I think the government should give the organs, not sell, for the ones in need.

Ciuciaro · 02-10-2008

If people want to sell an organ they can, it's theirs. But it shouldn't be allowed, because we would get people selling other peoples organs. Seems like a new generation of crime.

King_Leopold · 02-10-2008

well its quite easy to tell who it belongs to, if i walk in carrying a kidney in my hand, chances are i didnt pull it out my own body lol

Ciuciaro · 02-11-2008

There s no name on a kidney you noticed?

King Stubby · 02-11-2008

check the kidney's DNA up to the Seller's!

TheRussianLord · 02-11-2008

Kidnapping and murdering people for organs is already an international business. It's completely illegal, but that doesn't stop many people.

King_Leopold · 02-11-2008

somebody watches too many movies....I have never read anything backing up this claim

King Stubby · 02-11-2008

then you'd be surprised! it's not just movies, it's shows like CSI

UnleashWC3 · 02-11-2008

While its not a major issue, It does happen in eastern europe or southeast asia. Rich people cant get a doner for an organ, they go find someone over in a 3rd world country, have them killed, and take it.

King_Leopold · 02-12-2008

Ive read about organs being taken from like executed chinese prisoners, but not like people being kidnapped for their organs

Ciuciaro · 02-14-2008

I bet 1€ that happens too

TheRussianLord · 02-14-2008

Here's a little bit on it.

Quote:

Indian Transplant Ring Kidnapped, Forcibly Removed Organs

he last things Mohammed Salim remembered were the knees pinning him to the ground, the guns pointed at his head, and, finally, the injection that sent him into oblivion.

When he awoke, he was in agonizing pain, uncertain where he was or why he was wearing a hospital gown.

``We have taken your kidney,'' a masked man calmly explained. ``If you tell anyone, we'll shoot you.''

Salim was one of the last victims in an organ transplant racket that police believe sold up to 500 kidneys to clients who traveled to India from around the world over the past nine years.

Police say that when they raided the operation's main clinic in this upscale New Delhi suburb last week, they broke up a ring spanning five Indian states and involving at least four doctors, several hospitals, two dozen nurses and paramedics and a car outfitted as a laboratory.

Subsequent raids uncovered a kidney transplant waiting list with 48 names and, in one clinic, five foreigners _ three Greeks and two Americans of Indian descent _ who authorities believe were waiting for transplants.

Only one doctor has been arrested so far and police are searching for the alleged ringleader, Amit Kumar, who has several aliases and has been accused in past organ transplant schemes elsewhere in India. Authorities believe he's fled the country.

``Due to its scale, we believe more members of the Delhi medical fraternity must have been aware of what was going on,'' Gurgaon Police Commissioner Mohinder Lal told reporters this week.

There long have been reports of poor Indians illegally selling kidneys, but the transplant racket in Gurgaon is one of the most extensive to come to light _ and the first with an element of so-called medical tourism.

The low cost of medical care in India has made it a popular destination for foreigners in need of everything from tummy tucks to heart surgery.

The Gurgaon kidney transplant racket, however, was not the types of operation the medical community wanted in the headlines. The case has shocked the country, sparking debate about medical ethics and organ transplant laws.

Some ``donors'' were forced onto the operating table at gunpoint, while others were tricked with promises of work, Lal said. There were also some who sold kidneys willingly, usually for between $1,125 to $2,250, the Hindustan Times newspaper reported. The sale of human organs is illegal in India.

Salim, 33, a laborer with five children, said he was lured from his home town a few hours outside New Delhi by a bearded stranger offering a construction job that paid 150 rupees ($3.75) a day, as well as food and lodging. He was told the work would last three months.

``I thought I could earn money and save it for my children,'' he said from a government hospital in Gurgaon, where he is recovering under police protection.

He was first taken to a two-room house ``in the jungle'' outside New Delhi where two gunmen held him for six days, he said. Then he was taken to a bungalow in Gurgaon, where armed men took a blood sample at gunpoint.

Salim said he tried to escape, but the doors were locked and within moments, the men were on top of him, sticking him with another needle while he slowly lost consciousness.

When he awoke and learned what happened, Salim thought he was soon to die _ he didn't know you could live with one kidney. He lay in a haze of pain and confusion for about a day, when the men, apparently tipped off to the coming raid, told him they had to move him.

Minutes later, police burst into the house and rescued Salim and two other men who also had their kidneys taken. He never received any money, he said.

``I don't know how I will survive,'' said Salim, whose five children were at the hospital. ``I am the only earner in the family and the doctors said I can't do heavy work.''

Shakeel Ahmed, 28, was in the hospital bed next to Salim, wincing in pain as he told his story. He is unmarried and has no children, but he is responsible for five nieces and nephews, he said.

``I'm sad, I'm angry. I don't know how I will care for them,'' Ahmed said, pointing to his elderly parents sitting on the foot of his bed. ``Why me?''

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

graal · 02-14-2008

Well, it might sound kinda evil, but what is 500 people in a population of about 1 billion?

I mean, 500 kidneys were "stolen"/bought from people... well, they don't mention how long it took... (it could have been years...)

So, I don't think the organs black market is a serious issue right now... but I do believe that if family could sell organs from people of their family, after this person is dead, the numbers would be much higher than 500 and there would be no harm... that's why I still think that the best solution is paying for organs, but only from dead people organs... (and only with family authorization, of course)

02-09-2008	#1
King_Leopold Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,436	Sellings Organs Heh ok, one last topic for tonight. Should people be allowed to sell their organs for money (kidneys and things like that)? Personally, beats me, Ill have to think on it, never thoiugh about it till I made this post. Go to this link, now. [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

02-09-2008	#2
graal Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 87	Re: Sellings Organs I never thought about it either, but I think it shouldn't be allowed, that would start to be a REALLY bad black market... and people can't really have a totally normal life with only 1 kidney... also, there aren't so many organs that could be sold... (I mean, that people don't need, and others do) I am kinda against selling blood, if you wanna know my opinion... many people who couldn't really give blood (because might have some disease still on first stages, when it can't be detected, or have given blood too little time ago) go and sell the blood because need some extra money... imagine if you could do it with organs... If blood couldn't be sold, only given, there wouldn't be those irregularities, only people really willing to give it and who knew that did not have any problem...

02-09-2008	#3
Typewriter Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Don't look under the stairs Posts: 320	Re: Sellings Organs I think if that was legalised graveyards would be bare from organed dead people within a month - people would dig graves, get organs, sell organs, put body back in ground. [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

02-09-2008	#6
King Stubby Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Underground Posts: 5,865	Re: Sellings Organs i think it'd be illegal, because who would be selling their organs? homeless people. then not only would they have no home or food or money, they'd have a missing kidney! And now, directly from chip's signature...

02-09-2008	#7
King_Leopold Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,436	Re: Sellings Organs The idea behind behind making it legal, is you wouldnt have a blackmarket, everything would be regulated. I didn't mean like graverobbing lol Pros: More organs would definately be available, and many people die before they can get transplants Cons; You are paying for body parts. Go to this link, now. [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

02-09-2008	#9
King Stubby Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Underground Posts: 5,865	Re: Sellings Organs Well, I'm pretty sure donating is okay. If you did get payed for donating an organ, they wouldn't pay much. (except in the knowledge that you saved someone's life) And now, directly from chip's signature...

02-09-2008	#10
King_Leopold Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,436	Re: Sellings Organs well i made the topic because i read an article about how more and more people are going to other countries like china and india to get transplants from people who are getting money when they give their organs. They are also illegal organ markets, Im not talking about those. Go to this link, now. [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

02-09-2008	#11
graal Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 87	Re: Sellings Organs But I am in favor of paying for organs donated after death... (a fixed price for each organ), so families would be more likely to donate the dead person's organs... it would really increase the donations, in my opinion... but I am still against donating living people organs.

02-09-2008	#12
King_Leopold Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,436	Re: Sellings Organs thats an interesting idea, who would you suggest pays though, the people getting the organs, or the governments for them Go to this link, now. [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

02-10-2008	#14
Ciuciaro Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Kingdom of the Netherlands Posts: 1,187	Re: Sellings Organs If people want to sell an organ they can, it's theirs. But it shouldn't be allowed, because we would get people selling other peoples organs. Seems like a new generation of crime.

02-10-2008	#15
King_Leopold Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,436	Re: Sellings Organs well its quite easy to tell who it belongs to, if i walk in carrying a kidney in my hand, chances are i didnt pull it out my own body lol Go to this link, now. [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

02-11-2008	#16
Ciuciaro Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Kingdom of the Netherlands Posts: 1,187	Re: Sellings Organs There s no name on a kidney you noticed?

02-11-2008	#17
King Stubby Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Underground Posts: 5,865	Re: Sellings Organs check the kidney's DNA up to the Seller's! And now, directly from chip's signature...

02-11-2008	#18
TheRussianLord Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 1,002	Re: Sellings Organs Kidnapping and murdering people for organs is already an international business. It's completely illegal, but that doesn't stop many people.

02-11-2008	#19
King_Leopold Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,436	Re: Sellings Organs somebody watches too many movies....I have never read anything backing up this claim Go to this link, now. [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

02-11-2008	#20
King Stubby Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Underground Posts: 5,865	Re: Sellings Organs then you'd be surprised! it's not just movies, it's shows like CSI And now, directly from chip's signature...

02-11-2008	#21
UnleashWC3 Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 17	Re: Sellings Organs While its not a major issue, It does happen in eastern europe or southeast asia. Rich people cant get a doner for an organ, they go find someone over in a 3rd world country, have them killed, and take it.

02-12-2008	#22
King_Leopold Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,436	Re: Sellings Organs Ive read about organs being taken from like executed chinese prisoners, but not like people being kidnapped for their organs Go to this link, now. [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

02-14-2008	#23
Ciuciaro Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Kingdom of the Netherlands Posts: 1,187	Re: Sellings Organs I bet 1€ that happens too

02-14-2008	#25
graal Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 87	Re: Sellings Organs Well, it might sound kinda evil, but what is 500 people in a population of about 1 billion? I mean, 500 kidneys were "stolen"/bought from people... well, they don't mention how long it took... (it could have been years...) So, I don't think the organs black market is a serious issue right now... but I do believe that if family could sell organs from people of their family, after this person is dead, the numbers would be much higher than 500 and there would be no harm... that's why I still think that the best solution is paying for organs, but only from dead people organs... (and only with family authorization, of course)